Jacek.degen.eth 🎩 on Warpcast

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Jacek.degen.eth 🎩 pfp

Jacek.degen.eth 🎩

1️⃣ The Lockup Vault – A Bad Deal for DEGEN? The vault was designed to require users to hold DEGEN in order to receive daily tipping allowances. The idea was that this would reduce sell pressure and incentivize long-term commitment. But the numbers tell a different story: • Right now, a 1.9M DEGEN deposit gives you a 10K DEGEN daily tip allowance • If fully farmed over a year, this results in an APR of 184% 😳 • That’s a massive ROI for a short lockup, creating huge inflation in the ecosystem This raises a key question: Are we getting enough back for giving out these rewards? Right now, it looks like the system is disproportionately benefiting farmers rather than long-term ecosystem participants.

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Jacek.degen.eth 🎩 pfp

Jacek.degen.eth 🎩

2️⃣ Is Tipping Still Effective? Tipping was one of the best marketing strategies early on. It got DEGEN into the hands of new users, helped spread the brand, and encouraged people to recruit others. But the momentum seems to be slowing: • In Season 11, only 565 new wallets (that never received an airdrop before) got DEGEN. • Yet, we spent $1M worth of DEGEN in that round. • That means it cost $1.7K per new wallet to onboard someone via tipping. That’s way too high for an acquisition cost, especially when there’s no guarantee that new wallets will stick around and engage long-term. If we’re mostly redistributing DEGEN to the same users, does tipping still make sense as a growth strategy? Or should we rethink how we use the treasury?

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Jacek.degen.eth 🎩

3️⃣ What’s the Best Way Forward? It’s clear that: ✔️ The vault is allowing high-yield farming, causing huge inflation ✔️ New user growth is slowing, while the cost of acquiring wallets via tipping is too high This leaves us with some important questions: • Are we really getting enough value for the DEGEN we’re distributing? • Would a traditional marketing strategy (or another distribution method) be more effective? • Should we rethink tipping & lockup incentives to make them more sustainable? We need to ensure DEGEN’s distribution is efficient, sustainable, and actually driving growth. Would love to hear thoughts from the community—what do you think? 👇

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meta-david 💥| Building Scoop3 pfp

meta-david 💥| Building Scoop3

My knee jerk reaction is: ✔️ Eliminate the lock-up concept ✔️ Use Open Rank to determine allowance ✔️ Keep tip-for-tip rules in place As you pointed out, when it's a lock-up, then essentially you open the floodgates for people to buy in and get a killer APR. The lockup also makes it harder politically to go after bad actors because they can always (somewhat reasonably) rebut and say they bought their position in the ecosystem. Going back into the Open Rank system eliminates the optical hurdles of eliminating bad actors because receiving the allowance is truly a privilege (not an entitlement) and also presumably the ones with higher open rank scores are inclined to act in good faith since their skin in the game is the social integrity they built here and just for just about everyone who has a high score, that isn't worth compromising for any amount of $Degen. :) Albeit, that's not a perfect solution and it certainly has its flaws, but no solution will be perfect. It's about optimizing. :)

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y0b pfp

Farmers learn fast, but they don't have time machines. A big part of the allo can be connected to past actions, and the qualifying actions should change often. They must reflect the value you want to achieve. For ex, using DL3 apps. Rotate the apps chosen. A small part of the allo can be kept predictable.

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Mikado pfp

I've been earning minimum $100 monthly through degen and reinvesting that since I signed up on FC and honestly a bit dependent on that. however I trust your judgment and decisions.

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dusan.framedl.eth pfp

dusan.framedl.eth

i would be curious to know the main reasons why people that are already here (either long time, or newcomers) don't participate in degen ecosystem... i would probably try to find the root causes for low adoption there and improve on that: e.g. i think locking (skin-in-the game) makes sense, but at the same time understand that it's a huge upfront investment for people that don't know what they're getting into ($50+ is a lot of money for many people) would it be possible to conduct a user research among existing, especially active and quality(?), users?

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Emily 🎩🃏🍖 pfp

Emily 🎩🃏🍖

I think the previous method, using Open Rank, was a much better method, using Open Rank people can't lock and get allowances for many accounts with many wallets. With Open Rank only real people can be active.

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Sujit 🇮🇳 🎩 pfp

Sujit 🇮🇳 🎩

There is a difference between moving fast and rushing. Can we take a break from tipping culture for a season and think about how we can deliver to the user who deserve degen!!! 🎩 Do not rush to make a decision we may find ourself in regrets. Prioritize your time and make the best decision for the community!!!

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Angelika Kollin

@angelikakollin

I am thinking something like this: 10-20% of one’s allowance gets added daily automatically to their locked amount From received tips for the season each person get to keep 30% rest goes into the pool which is equally divided among all participants. Or something similar with different %

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Fookinnowan 🎩🔵 pfp

Fookinnowan 🎩🔵

At the moment, I can only think of these stuff: - Keep tipping as it was the core when DEGEN started and we shouldn't let that die down - Not to revert allowance solely to openrank else it will again shift the majority of the allowance portion back to the same set of "huge, good, OG" user who contribution towards DEGEN is kinda questionable nowadays

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Matt pfp

What is the goal?

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LΞO 🎩 pfp

If tipping is being farmed = locked degen is being used to pack small group of bags Then why not make new rules to the game on where tips can be used = get degen into the hands of new bags At the same time figure out a way to creat utility that is deflationary. -degen for buying on rodeo?

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Marwa 🔵🎩🍖 pfp

Marwa 🔵🎩🍖

in my opinion, consider to switch back to the engagement rank (open rank) with Vault lock , and daily tipping allowance shouldn't exceed 5000 degenn, i think in this case , farming could be reduced ! i'm not sure will completely reduced but i believe 50% farming would be reduced !

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Ferran 🐒 pfp

I don't know if it may help, but requiring some sort of Gitcoin Passport score on top as a Proof of Humanity could potentially help in the short-mid term before other mechanisms took over? For example: If I lock 1M$ Degen and my Gitcoin Passport score is >50, I get 5k $degen allowance for tipping. But if I have <50, then I only get 500 $degen. Other quick fixes for the short term: - The inflation rate should be reduced a lot. It doesn't benefit anyone in the long run to have 180% APY. - Implement some burning mechanism (?) I also think Degen should be valuable for the community, so more focus on easy crowdfunding solutions for projects aligned with the community could be a good driver for $Degen. But it should be easy to do.

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artlu 🎩 pfp

let's try Degen Communism https://vitalik.eth.limo/general/2024/04/01/dc.html "Do not try to enforce stasis. Instead, embrace the chaos of markets and other fast-paced human activity. At the same time, however, tweak rules in such a way that the upsides get funneled into supporting public goods (including quality of the governance itself), and the downsides get capped or even outright removed for the people who are not able to handle it. This can be a way forward for everyone in the 21st century." - @vitalik.eth

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Smash Thunder Stone 🎩🏹🧾 pfp

Smash Thunder Stone 🎩🏹🧾

@smashthunderston

I think the vault and locking is the best thing to happen to degen tipping. It was surprising to see how many "Degens" who had a huge allowance going off of OR, dump when the vault started. There is no perfect answer or solution to the farming issue, but what we are doing now is far and above better than when we did not use the vault. I agree with this as well: https://warpcast.com/alemac/0x6e996048

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Tim pfp

Imo the more you change the worse off it’ll be. Focus more on x promotion and have kols talk about the token

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TimeTree 🌳 pfp

1️⃣ If the $Degen tipping system incorporating AI is expanded to X, new wallets will naturally increase exponentially. 2️⃣ A natural way to eliminate farming is to provide other benefits when tipping high-quality post. For example, every time I give more than 100 tips to a new person, I get a degen certificate. I hope that the more certificates I have, the more benefits I will receive in the future (e.g. the proportion of airdrops for D-L3 new tokens, etc.) People will naturally share tips with new people only when such benefits and new fun elements arise.

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what 🤘🎭 pfp

The vault Idea has another downside - it actually is "make the rich richer" You need money to make money instead of needing enthusiasm and a great mindset to make money. Maybe the tipping and allowance idea of @justbuild would incentivize more great content https://justbuild.today/how-to-earn-units -The effort is higher since only by moderators approved casts can generate an allowance. Not sure about growing Userbase - this is such a hard task you see as well jesse is struggling to get more people on base etc.

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SuperBuu pfp

If the vault is to continue I would suggest make it equal among everyone regardless of how much they lock. 1k degen daily for allowances. Almost impossible to farm that way. The impact would be far less anyway. Degens life lasts longer and tipping becomes more of a gracious gesture until things go back up. Maybe a program is created for loyal degen users known not to farm that allow them an allowance without locking.

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Cristian 🎩 pfp

@cristianisbased.eth

Honestly, the best solution is to get rid of the Degen vault altogether. And replace it with staking. That way you won't see massive sell pressure from those unlocks but incentivize others to stake their degen instead of locking it. Now regarding Degen allowance I feel this should be based off OpenRank to an extent but why not benefit those who tip more others. Right now the tip4tip rule at 15 is fine. But what if you tip 15+ people who haven't tipped you, and are new to the degen ecosystem this results in you getting more allowance. Of course they need to be real people and not just farming accounts. And that's where it gets tricky!

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