Ngl recently I’ve immediately churned when trying any products that have anything to do with an ERC20 or points

building with @emo.eth / prev: manifold.xyz opensea.io

Hmm not sure I understand this.

We're in crypto - to pretend that tokens or points are not the single biggest unlock for creating a net new generation of product experiences feels weird to me.

I respect your desire to find crypto products that have PMF in the absence of incentives but hasn't been the case so far and probs won't for a long time IMO

Onchain is the new online - FID 206 -  Building /coop-recs

I'm not saying they need to have incentives - I'm saying that products that focus on tokens have historically been the most widely used in crypto.

Uniswap, Metamask, Coinbase, OpenSea, TopShot the list goes on.

Olaf said Bitcoin is the crypto product with the most PMF.

I agree we need to break out of the bubble - I disagree that in order to do that we need to pretend tokens don't exist or aren't the category defining asset that makes this new generation of tech valuable relative to whats existed before.

It hasn't been the case that crypto products with incentives have found PMF 🤷

It's the biggest unlock in the eyes of people in crypto who have yet to break out of the bubble. It feels weird this is the norm and just feels grifty to me. Building a good product with incentives later (i.e. Rainbow) is different.

Building the last mile delivery DePIN @nosh

Not yet.

It has PMF within crypto but far from PMF in the real world.

I think it has the most PMF for any crypto consumer product that has been built thus far and it will find true PMF at some point in the next decade.

"Have you also noticed that tokens or points play a crucial role in driving new product experiences within the crypto space? Despite the desire to focus on products with strong market fit without incentives, do you think this approach will realistically prevail anytime soon?"