Vitalik Buterin pfp
Vitalik Buterin
@vitalik.eth
I'm noticing lots of people with both the opinion "I don't think I could work under a boss" and "hierarchies are efficient". But there's a tension between these two. Efficiency properly understood isn't output per man-hour, it's output per unit unpleasantness. That follows from standard econ definitions of efficiency.
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Vitalik Buterin pfp
Vitalik Buterin
@vitalik.eth
Of course a given person could argue that they're uniquely hierarchy-averse and hierarchy is good for normies, but it's always healthy to have some suspicion when your logic leads you to say "unpleasant thing X is good but it's for other people".
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grant 🌈 🎩 🐸 pfp
grant 🌈 🎩 🐸
@grunt.eth
So - if you love your job you will approach infinite efficiency Love to see it
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Sam (crazy candle person) ✦ pfp
Sam (crazy candle person) ✦
@samantha
I would go even further and say it’s lack of autonomy instead of unpleasantness High autonomy + high output = feel good Low autonomy + high output = feel bad
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Mac Budkowski 🥝 pfp
Mac Budkowski 🥝
@macbudkowski
Most of my friends who say they couldn't work under a boss never had a great boss.
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Thomas pfp
Thomas
@aviationdoctor.eth
In my professional world, ICs are the exception, not the norm. It was a bit of a culture shock landing here in founder-rich FC. For me it’s not so much the hierarchy vs anarchy that creates efficiency, it’s good old incentives and disincentives, as Charlie Munger would say. Hierarchies exist to keep tabs on those
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ngmi🔵🧾🎩 pfp
ngmi🔵🧾🎩
@ngmi
Yo V what you plan to do with your $DEGEN airdrop coming soon?
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tldr (tim reilly) pfp
tldr (tim reilly)
@tldr
But if there is a spectrum of how much unpleasantness people find in hierarchy, these statements don’t have to be contradictory. (for example, it is very unpleasant from the person you heard saying it but less unpleasant, neutral, or even pleasant for a plurality of others)
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flick the dev 🎩📦 pfp
flick the dev 🎩📦
@flick
I like the getting paid regularly part (working for a boss), even if I know it's a little short changed I get to focus on the tech and get to leave strategy and BD to the experts
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netop://ウエハ pfp
netop://ウエハ
@netopwibby.eth
My problem is never having the "holy grail" boss outside my time in retail. In tech, we hear all sorts of stories about great founders and what people learned working closely with them. I've yet to experience that and at this point, I'm looking forward to being that person. A good boss makes hierarchies work.
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m_j_r pfp
m_j_r
@m-j-r.eth
imho, the ideal is the currency of organization. it isn't so much that we aren't cognizant of some compromise or deferral to some arbiter, but that there isn't some "unpleasantness floor" depleting the value/fulfillment of contribution. hierarchies often ossify into unpleasantness creep.
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Rafi 🍋 pfp
Rafi 🍋
@rafi
Hierarchies doesn’t always necessities *feeling* of having a boss. With proper management (or lack of it) people can feel intrinsically motivated to do their work. Examples: work of Jos de Blok and Dee Hock.
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adrienne pfp
adrienne
@adrienne
mipsytipsy just wrote a new blog that touches on this a bit- hierarchy is a property of self organizing teams too many people have had too many experiences with bad bosses 😢 https://charity.wtf/2024/01/05/questionable-advice-my-boss-says-we-dont-need-any-engineering-managers-is-he-right/
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Christian Montoya 🦊 pfp
Christian Montoya 🦊
@m0nt0y4
IMO people who feel that way haven't had a good boss
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Garrett 🎩↑ᖽ pfp
Garrett 🎩↑ᖽ
@garrett
what do you mean by “output per unit unpleasantness”? Well designed organizational structures increase efficiency but they don’t necessarily need to be heirarchies
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Greg Lang pfp
Greg Lang
@designheretic
It’s a trade-off One some are more inclined to make one way—and some more the other Neither is per se worse globally
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Angler 🖼️ pfp
Angler 🖼️
@angler
I could work for a boss again if it's someone I admire. The bigger problem is that most people are bad bosses and we are promoting the wrong people for the wrong reasons. Experts should be able to make major money without having to manage other people.
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