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July
@july
A few things I found fascinating reading through the UAP hearing doc (I skimmed Gold and Shellenberger’s hearing docs ~400 pages) - UAPs are a real unexplained phenomena, we can say this w/o knowing what they are - first step is acknowledging this - vehicles have mass: they show up on visual spectrum, radar and infrared (they have a pretty big Radar Cross Section, they aren’t stealth) - vehicles are transmedium: seamlessly move through different mediums like water, air, space etc - show no signs of causing friction - vehicle has autonomous control: they react to the planes or other vehicles around it; they react based on what’s going on around them, that means they have sensors, a control system, path planning etc - vehicles have non combustion engine propulsion: field propulsion of some sort, manipulating gravity etc are properties that this vehicle has shown to exhibit - vehicles move in super high G maneuvers https://oversight.house.gov/hearing/unidentified-anomalous-phenomena-exposing-the-truth/
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Thomas
@aviationdoctor.eth
The whole thing doesn’t sit well with me. If we accept the premise (that there are incontrovertible observational data of physical objects with mass performing intentional maneuvers that defy our understanding of gravity), then it necessarily makes the agnostic position (“we can say this w/o knowing who they are”) rather untenable. Because again, if we accept that premise, then they’re either alien craft or breakthrough human mil craft; there really isn’t any other physical phenomena that fit the data (such as meteorological events, weather balloons, sightings of Venus, etc). The alternative is to reject the premise, and question the data as either fabricated (e.g., psyop), erroneous (e.g., sensor artefacts), or misinterpreted (e.g., human error). So I think it boils down to: have we reached such a critical mass of independently-collected data that consistently cross-validate each other, and whose chain of custody is undisputable, that we must accept the premise? 1/n
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Thomas
@aviationdoctor.eth
I haven’t read the 400 pages yet, so I’m happy to entertain that position for now (if anything, for the sake of the gedanken). But then we have to accept either the “advanced alien” or “advanced mil” hypothesis. I can’t really think of any other explanation. If it’s alien, what doesn’t sit well with me is this: let’s assume a highly advanced civilization has mastered interstellar space travel and visits us. They have a choice: reveal themselves to us, or not. They haven’t formally chosen the former, but they also somehow seem to fail at doing the latter. It seems sensible that they would have the tech to remain completely unseen if they chose to (even we possess materials that are practically invisible to radar). It sounds unlikely that they would get unwillingly picked up by our primitive tech… unless they didn’t care either way, of course, like we don’t care if chimps witness our planes flying above their heads. 2/n
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